Okay, so just logistical. Can you confirm your name, the spelling, your preferred pronouns, and the best way to title you?
My name is Becky Harper B EC KYHARPER. And I'm she, and I don't have a title related to this story. I'm a real estate agent in the Raleigh area.
Awesome. And okay, so tell me a little bit about your I guess history with gerrymandering isn't quite the best way to, to say sort of that. Yeah, so
I have been a supporter of common cause in North Carolina for many years. And through common cause. North Carolina, I ended up as the named plaintiff on a series of gerrymandering lawsuits that were filed by common cause on behalf of voters and citizens. So my name has been associated with, with the anti gerrymandering cause. For a number of years, the first lawsuit was filed in 2019. And, and those two cases in North Carolina morphed into more Moore V. Harper, which was heard by the US Supreme Court on December 7, last year.
Perfect, thank you, I can, I can tell that you're well trained with the media that was a very concise and thorough explanation. So.
So tell me a little bit about how the effects of gerrymandering that you've seen in North Carolina, what are your observations about gerrymandering in North Carolina, and how it affects voters like who does it disproportionately affect and why I guess the problem
with gerrymandering is that it means that voters don't have choices. The elections are often fixed, the outcome of elections is determined by where the lines are drawn. And it's hard for voters to understand this, because they like to think that when they go to the ballot box, they're choosing between two viable candidates. But often, because of gerrymandered districts, one candidate wins by overwhelming margins. And we we have fewer and fewer genuinely competitive districts at any level of government in North Carolina, our general assembly is is heavily gerrymandered, and our congressional seats are heavily gerrymandered. Let me correct that. Right now. Our congressional seats. The Congressional map is actually a fair math that was imposed by the court for the 2022 congressional election. And that's a good example of how elections should probably turn out in North Carolina, North Carolina isn't purple state, almost equally divided between people who tend to vote democratic and people who tend to vote Republican. And we have 14 congressional seats. And right now, we have seven Democrats and seven Republicans representing North Carolina in the United States Congress. That is a fair reflection of how voters tend to vote in North Carolina. But our general assembly districts are heavily gerrymandered and as a result, one party has a super majority in the General Assembly and can enact pretty much any policies that they want.
Yes, hoping that works for you. Yes. Awesome. Sorry. I was scribbling down a few notes. Yes. That is, once again, perfectly concise. So then you kind of hit on this earlier. But how does a gerrymandered legislature affect issues like abortion, where the general population has very strong feelings about it on either side?
Well, in North Carolina, the only way we have to measure the the general populations views on abortion, are from public opinion, polling and so forth. But what's happened when abortion was actually put on the ballot as a single issue, in traditionally conservative states, like Ohio and Kansas, is that the voters did not, in fact behave as they were expected to by the leaders of the Republican Party. And that might also happen in North Carolina, we don't know. Because in North Carolina, we do not have the ability to forge direct referenda. Lots of states allow citizens to get together and get a get signatures on a petition and put an issue on the ballot for the voters to decide directly. We don't have that right in North Carolina. It's not provided for in our state's constitution.
If you don't mind me circling back a little bit to what you said, about Republican, like the Republican Party, and voters not voting, according to like how polls predicted them. Like, can you explain that to me a little bit more?
Well, I can't really I'm an expert on polling or, but I do know that Kansas and Ohio are traditionally Republican states. They have heavily Republican legislatures. And yet, when the voters were asked directly, how they felt about the issue of abortion, and whether they wanted to protect abortion in their state law, the votes were very decisively in favor of protecting the right to abortion.
I gotcha. I see what you're saying. Now, I was a little confused at first, but yes, yes. Awesome.
And let me just say also that, and I'm sorry about all this rain that I'm driving through here. But you know, the fundamental problem with gerrymandered districts is that the voters don't get choices between candidates who hold different positions. And so the voters are stymie the voters are awarded in their efforts to elect people who will represent their point of view. And whether the issue is abortion or other issues, support for public education support for the university system. You know, there are a variety of issues which the voters public opinion indicates that there's broad support for these things. But our general assembly feels otherwise and and their position is cast in stone because they have drawn safe districts for themselves. And so they're able to perpetuate the strength of a particular political party, which then holds particular political views and gerrymandering is a bipartisan sin. And here in North Carolina, we have a Republican majority that has engaged in extreme gerrymanders and has been fighting to protect their right to gerrymander in this series of lawsuits. But there are states that are gerrymandered in favor of the Democrats. So it tends to be something that happens when, when any political party gains power, they like to protect themselves.
Yes. Is there anything, any key distinctions that you want to further make or any pieces of this story that
you think I'm missing that I didn't ask you about?
I think you've done a great job. And I know I gave you way too much that no, no.
I love it. Because whenever you have a way of explaining it, so well, that makes it a lot easier for me to explain it. So that's, that's great. That was very helpful. Thank you for working me in. I really appreciate it. I hope you're welcome.
Thanks for the work you do and please make sure to send me a copy of your article,